CODY ALVEY - I AM ONE Mom Driven to Make a Difference for Others (Anxiety, PPD, ADHD, Intrusive Thoughts)

Trigger Warning: Intrusive Thoughts

On today’s episode, we’re sitting down with the self-proclaimed “Most Devoted Listener of the I AM ONE Podcast, the amazing - Cody Alvey. Cody is a Perinatal Mental Health-Certified Lactation Educator, and the Executive Assistant extraordinaire to PSI’s Executive Director, Dr. Wendy Davis. We’ll hear all about Cody’s lifelong experience with anxiety, diagnoses of both complex PTSD & ADHD, and how she became involved with PSI in the first place. Through this conversation, Cody beautifully illustrates that when it comes to experiencing perinatal mental health disorders, you are not alone, you’re not to blame for feeling how you fell, and that with help you will be well. So without any further ado, please sit back, relax, and enjoy this episode with our friend, Cody.

Mentioned in today's episode:

• CAPPA
• PSI Components of Care Training 
• Podcasts: Mom & Mind, Tig & Cheryl: True Story
• Book: Cat's Cradle

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Fill out our podcast interest form here!

Questions about the I AM ONE Podcast?
Email Dani Giddens - dani@postpartum.net

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Transcript

Intro

0:00

On today's episode, we're sitting down with the self-proclaimed most devoted listener of the IM1 podcast, the amazing Cody Alvy. Cody is a perinatal mental health certified lactation educator and the executive assistant extraordinaire to PSI's executive director, Dr. Wendy Davis. We'll hear all about Cody's lifelong experience with anxiety, diagnoses of both complex PTSD and ADHD, and how she became involved with PSI in the first place. Through this conversation, Cody beautifully illustrates that when it comes to experiencing perinatal mental health disorders, you are not alone. You are not to blame for feeling how you feel, and with help, you will be well. So without any further ado, please sit back, relax, and enjoy this episode with our friend Cody. The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed in the I Am One podcast are the speaker's own. Tuning into this podcast is not a replacement for therapy or any other form of professional help. Our discussions cover personal stories of perenatal mental health disorders and may feel triggering to some listeners. Your number one priority is to take care of yourself. So if you are in need of support, please reach out to the PSI helpline by calling or texting H E L P to 1-800-944-4773 for help in English and in Spanish. At PSI, we want you to know you are not alone, you are not to blame, and with help, you will be well. Okay, let's get on with the podcast.

Meet Cody Alvey

1:33

Cody, welcome to the pod, my friend. We are so happy to spend some time with you this afternoon and to hold some space for you to share some of your lived experience with us. Yes, I'm so excited to be here. We're so excited to hang out with you. Yeah. It'll be the only episode that goes for six hours. That's totally possible. It's a mini series. It'll be a little more. It's our debut mini series. Watch out, PBS. We'll be like rabbit hole part one through six. Six series. Yes, that's kind of how our pre-recording meeting went. That's true. Conversation flowed easily. So we're very excited to be sitting here chatting with you. Cody, are you ready to get personal? I am so ready to get personal. Open book. Let's do this. Question number one, Cody. If you would be so kind, please tell us a little bit about yourself. And also, part two of the question, can you tell us what role perinatal mood and anxiety disorders have played in your life? Yes. I am Cody Alvy, pronounced she, her. I am the assistant to the director at PSI, or the executive assistant. And I have been working for PSI for one year this week. I am so excited. Happy anniversary! Happy anniversary! Thank you. Jinx. Thank you. It's such an honor. And I really, really, really love this job. And I hope this is year one of many years as I hear from many of my colleagues. Yeah. Agree. Don't ever leave us. I'll never leave you. No. I'll never leave. You'll have to ask me to go. I won't. Perfect.

Prenatal Anxiety & Intrusive Thoughts

3:15

Perinatal mood and anxiety disorders have played a huge role in my life. I had them long before I knew about them. I feel like in hindsight, I so I have one child who will be seven, probably about the time this podcast comes out. Cool. Happy birthday, human. He's so excited about it. We're in party planning mode, which is one of my least favorite tasks as a parent, but is necessary for a good childhood. Oh yeah. That stuff, you know, you only turn seven once. Um, anyway, when I got pregnant, I did not intend to get pregnant, but also had was already in a committed relationship and knew we were gonna have children. So we there was never a question. We're gonna keep this pregnancy, we're gonna have a baby. We were excited within like 24 hours of under of knowing I was pregnant. Just the initial shock had to wear off. Yeah. Yes. But within a couple of days, I I I really settled into some severe anxiety. I had I have had anxiety my entire life. I think that there's a genetic component to that where just I've always just been an anxious personality type and it waxed and waned as experiences happened to me growing up. And I started having intrusive thoughts probably within about a week of getting pregnant. It became fair. And I didn't know what they were, right? So I'm I'll talk a lot about this lingo, but I didn't know then what I was experiencing. So my reoccurring intrusive thought, which I will vaguely touch on because I don't like to get detailed about intrusive thoughts and weird. They're contagious. Yeah, yeah. Agreed. Yeah. There's no vaccine for those. Exactly. Yeah. I was so worried about losing an unintended pregnancy because then I would be forced to decide if we were going to make an intended choice the next time. And I wasn't sure if I was ready. So I had this weird disconnect between like, I'm so obsessed with this working out, but if it doesn't, I don't know if like I'm actually ready to commit outside of the accident that this happened. And I was really lost in that. And for months and months, like at least the first three months, and then my anxiety started to come down a little bit. I had a really early ultrasound because my midwife thought that earlier ultrasound would be better than extreme anxiety for the fetus. Like it was this like risk comparison. I wasn't a high-risk pregnancy, but she's like, I need you to see that this child has a heartbeat so that you can calm down a little bit, like things are going well. Yeah. And that totally helped. I had like a six-week ultrasound. Wow. Yeah. So once I saw that tiny little like blip, which is all that it looks like at six weeks, I was like, Yeah, it's like it's like real. Like this is happening. And that that totally helped a lot. And then I as pregnancy went on, I was still anxious, but I had a better understanding that like my midwife was able to say, like, your hormones are changing. This is a life change, like it's natural to be anxious about it. And then so I'd say anxiety was my my prenatal for sure. And then but I never did any medication or anything. I was really, really worried about medication and did not want to do anything to hurt this baby because it played on that fear, right? And I just couldn't get past the fact that it was okay, even though I had a provider saying it's safe to take medication in pregnancy. I was like, no, I don't, I don't buy that, which it is totally safe under medical care. Yes. When it's recommended. But I was so anxious I couldn't get past

Postpartum Depression After Birth

6:48

it. And then postpartum, pretty much immediately I got to add on the fun diagnosis of postpartum depression also. And that happened pretty instantaneously. You mentioned before that you had had anxiety previously, that you were like, that you had the name for it. Like you were either diagnosed or you somehow knew to this was anxiety, right? Yes. When it showed up during pregnancy, did it look totally different? And therefore, were you like, what is this? Or were you able to right away go, well, hello, anxiety, welcome back. This is a great question. I was like, hello, anxiety, welcome back to my life. I thought I had you kind of under control. I mean, I had a diagnosis, um, like an actual clinical diagnosis of anxiety by the time I was seven, eight, I would say. And I had seen a therapist often on different therapists from the time I was, I'm kind of guessing here because obviously I was a child. I'm gonna say nine or ten, I was seeing a therapist fairly regularly. And so I understood what anxiety felt like. I had been doing a lot of therapy on how to know that a panic attack was coming versus an anxiety attack. I had been through mindfulness, like trainings, read the books and done all this stuff. And so, but when I got pregnant, it felt totally out of my control. I had this cognitive dissonance between knowing. I knew that there would be changes and that it would be a difficult adjustment. I did not realize I would be feeling them. It's like I just thought, like, pregnancy will be interesting for me and things will be changing in my body and my hormones and my mind, but I just thought of it like a thing that would happen to anyone. I didn't think about it like, and I'll be feeling the moods. I will be the one that can't sleep at night. I will be the one with the intrusive thoughts. I just didn't have that connection. Yeah. So it looked the same. It looked the same as my previous anxiety. But I think the only new symptom for me was that I had energy and tiredness at the wrong and really inconvenient times. Really awake in the middle of the night, really exhausted in the middle of the day. And so that was a big challenge for me to figure out like, why aren't I sleeping? I've always been able to sleep. You said anxiety attack and panic attack.

Anxiety Attacks vs. Panic Attacks

9:04

Yeah. What's the difference? Ah, great question. So, to me, the way I would describe it is that an anxiety attack is feeling if you're a person with anxiety that is kind of constantly worried about stuff, an anxiety attack is like a prolonged period of time where that's higher. And it doesn't feel like an emergency. You're still in control of your body, but you're like, I'm just extra anxious. I just need that weighted blanket, or I just need my comfort food, or I just need to take a drive. I'm just kind of feeling it's too much right now. And it can kind of ebb and flow. And you can get past it with like, I don't know, for me, it really helps to like go take a shower, but like turn the lights off until it's dark in the shower. It's like a sensory shower. Oh. I'm gonna try that. That sounds like so nice. If you I added sensory shower. Sensory shower. My therapist recommended this. And I added in red Christmas lights around the top of the bathroom. My husband did this for me. And so it's like it doesn't make your brain feel like you're in light, but you can see enough that you're not in pitch black darkness. I don't like pitch black, although some people probably do. Or anyway, back to anxiety. I will probably like lay on my back and put my feet up against the wall, do some, just kind of like interrupt that process. A panic attack is like you may know that it's coming, but you often find yourself in the middle of it. Things feel like an emergency. You're not thinking clearly. It catches you off guard, kind of like you're just like, what's going on? Yes, it's like, man, I knew I was anxious, but now I can't breathe. Or now I can't focus at all. Like I was already struggling, but now I'm uncontrollably sobbing. Or I need a direct, immediate intervention to interrupt this process for me. And it's not gonna be basic self-care. It's like some things in the past that have helped me is like I need to lay in the bed with someone next to me telling me that I'm okay for a minute or 10 minutes or whatever. Last time I had a panic attack, I walked up and down my stairs like 25 times because I had so much like cortisol pumping through me. And my therapist recommended when I have panic attacks to like do like a short burst of like break a sweat to interrupt it. And but it's hard. It's hard. I've never had a panic attack where I also went, here's how to fix it. It's that outside person who's 99% of the time my husband going, you need to get this energy out, or go lay down, or you're safe. You know, it's I need that extra person. I can control my anxiety attack by going, This is an anxiety attack. A panic attack's its own world. And um, I don't have them often now. I didn't have them in pregnancy, but as a child, I had them a lot. And I had to, I had really had to learn to overcome that, you know, it was almost like a in fact, I think for a while I even had the diagnosis of panic disorder where it was just like these waves of out of control. Yeah, which can be really scary as a new parent. Really scary all the time, but as a new parent, it's like if you're losing control of you, it's really scary to be around a little person at the same time. Right. So, Cody, were the anxiety and panic attacks happening like postpartum and during your pregnancy? Yeah, great question. The um anxiety attacks carried on through prenatal and postpartum. I don't recall having many panic attacks in that period. I think that I was in a really heavy

Dissociation & Missing Postpartum Memories

12:26

state of disassociation where it was like, if you which I will define, it's not it's like I knew where I was and who I was and what I was doing, but I was out of touch with my emotions. They were so big that a part of my brain, which I now know is my limbic system, was going, we're gonna keep you from this because it's so big and so powerful that you're gonna just kind of be constantly checked out. The problem with being constantly checked out, I mean the pro, the pros are little to no panic attacks, no big responses, the ability to survive, right? Yes, right. The cons of severe disassociation are complete lack of focus, often a complete lack of making memories during a time period. I have whole points of my childhood, and in addition to that, whole points of my postpartum period that have no memory of whatsoever. I know I was there, I have videos and pictures, I had all the Instagram posts, right? But I just can't, I can't like close my eyes and picture having a six-month-old. Nothing comes up. I just see the pictures and the videos that I have seen of myself. It's not real. Versus like this week or a year ago, I can picture everything about my son's sixth birthday last year. I remember the day really well. I remember what he wore and how he felt and how cute it was. I don't have that from him as a baby. And so I am thankful I didn't have panic attacks, but I missed out on a lot not having the support and the help that reached me. I don't know how better to say that. I had support, I had help. It just wasn't I didn't see myself in the ex in this resources that were given to me. I had an anxiety workbook. I wasn't gonna open that. I had, you know, like YouTube videos and affirmation cards that just wasn't me. I just needed someone to just look me square in the eye and be like, this is a thing. And then I couldn't turn away from it. And that took a long, long time for me. For sure. That's a good segue. Tell us more. Tell us when you were faced with it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, happily. So

Realizing She Needed Perinatal Mental Health Support

14:40

I knew that things were not normal. Having had anxiety before and depression before, but not as often. I knew what I was feeling was not how it's supposed to feel when you have a baby. What I did not know was the intricate details of depression and anxiety in the perinatal period. I didn't understand that it feels different and looks different. And I was trying to sometimes, but often completely neglecting my own needs because I was just trying to survive a lack of sleep and just a difficult postpartum period anyway. I had a high needs baby. Shout out to high needs parents. It's a struggle. And so, on top of having a newborn, I had a newborn with extra things going on. And it was just so it was taking up so much of my energy that there was no time for me to focus on like how to feel better. It was just like, I did it, he's alive another day. Yeah. And my husband was largely in the same place, and he also was suffering from postpartum depression. And I knew I had an issue. He knew he wasn't happy with what was going on, but I didn't have a name for mine, let alone his. I didn't even know men got postpartum depression, especially one in ten of them, probably more. And so when I was first faced with it, I had started a support group for new moms in my little rural town. We didn't have we didn't have much in the way of therapists or support here. We have a midwife who is fantastic, but is very busy focusing on the birth part of birth and um is not a therapist, but who could prescribe psychiatric medicine and would, but did not have the time or the staff to continually host like a home visit or a repeated follow-up care. I at the time and a lot of the people in this county, I'm in southern Oregon in a really remote town. A lot of the people in this county have Medicaid. They do a little more now, but in 2016, when my son was born, they did not do many follow-up visits coverage. And so I think I had like six, and we just kept calling them like lactation visits, but they were about all kinds of things, just like trying to like get the insurance to keep covering what was going on. Yeah. And so I started a support group when my son was like nine months old for breastfeeding moms. I had a really hard time breastfeeding and I overcame the difficulties with a lot of help, and then realized that if I had that many difficulties, everyone else would too. And so I just started inviting other people in the community to come meet in person and talk about it and to help them. And I started just soaking in as many like free trainings as I could find. And then the midwife that I was, she was helping me with the support group. She hired me on a really limited basis through a grant through our early learning hub here in Oregon. Oregon has these fantastic early learning hubs that provide information, education, and funding to promote early learning. And the one closest to us, thankfully, and everyone should, believes that a happy mom makes a healthy kindergartner. I mean, really, if you you can make that stretch. And so the early learning hub funded a lot of that for us. Anyway, so they funded for me to go to the two-day PSI training.

Finding PSI & Starting Rural Perinatal Support

17:56

Wow, enter inter PSI. Inter PSI. Because I was like, man, I we have a lot of moms. You know, at the time, I again I didn't know dads were affected. So I was talking to the midwife, and we're like, man, we have a lot of moms coming in experiencing like depression and anxiety. And like, what do we do really about that? Because the go-to was the midwife would like prescribe Zoloft and give a referral to mental health. But the mental health here is a really long waiting list with no yeah, and still today, but then also no specialized care. And we did not have at the time there's an organ coordinator for PSI, but we didn't even know that that was a thing, really. We had a poster, I think, in the clinic that said like one in five and seven moms, and with a number, right? But it was like, what is that? Like it just wasn't computing. So I went to the two-day training, and back then our lovely director, Wendy Davis, was doing a lot of those trainings. PSI's grown so fast in the last few years. Back in the day. Back in the day, Wendy and Wendy and our lovely Birdie were doing the most of them. So um tag team for sure. Oh, yeah. Like the perfect tag team. I mean, if you're lucky enough to have had a Wendy Birdie training, I mean, like, man, what a club. So anyway, Wendy, it was just Wendy because this one was close to Wendy's home. And so she came and talked for two days. And at the end of the first day, I was so enthralled with this information. I felt so seen. I was like, oh my God, the thing I'm having is real. One, it's also, I'm kind of afraid everyone I know has it. And also, like, this is such an important topic. I still have recordings on my phone of her talking during that training because I was just trying to soak it all in. I was literally recording it on my phone. Like, tell me more, tell me more. And so I really wanted to speak to her in the break of the training. I was so nervous. And I went up to her and I was like, I think what I wanted to say was like, this is a really great training, and I'm so excited to do this work. And what came out of my mouth was like, I think I have a thing that you're talking about. Just like immediate tears. Wendy's like the perfect person to have tears in front of, though. She hugged me. Yeah. Oh, yeah. And I was like, and I think my husband has it. Is that a thing? She's like, Yes, that's a thing. I uh it really took off from there for me. I that same day I learned so many things. I first off, I learned home visitors are like a thing that day. Oh I had a Wick home visitor who I loved so much, like a little healthy start visitor, but she came, I think she came like three times. Like that's what our county covered was like through Wick, three times for new babies. And she brought a nurse with her to like do a weight and you know that stuff. They gave me a pump. They were so kind. But I didn't know that home visitors like can keep coming. That was so cool. So I I learned about home visiting. I learned that postpartum depression was like a totally legit real thing that happens to people and that there's other diagnosis within that. And I was seeing myself in a lot of that, and that was definitely how I was introduced to it. And I even remember asking her, and I was really nervous. I was like, I have this Facebook group for new moms in my county. Like, will you join it? Like and help us. And she's like, Yeah, totally. She's Wendy's Wendy, she's still a member. How funny is that? Wendy's in your mom's group. Oh my god. She's so nice. She was like, Yeah, of course I will. Like, she hasn't anything else going on. She'll join this like small hundred moms in southern Oregon group. She's perfect like that. So anyway, yep. So helpful. And there were multiple times where I would like send her a Facebook message, like, we have this mom, and she just like immediately answered, like, no sweat. And I'm like, Are you kidding me? This is so kind. Thus became my years long, never ending just adoration of Dr. Wendy Davis. I mean, oh my gosh. Wendy absolutely changed my life and helped me understand that there's this whole ecosystem that was. PSI and that they could recommend even then therapists and support people and ideas and posters and handouts and brochures. And man, I just soaked in that information. I at the same time I took a training in lactation through Kappa, really loved that organization also. Yeah. I'm a lactation educator through them. Huge shout out to Kappa and soaked in all of that information. So I came back to this support group armed with breastfeeding knowledge, really just infant feeding knowledge. Yeah. As well as information about perinatal mood and anxiety disorders. And then got sort of a healthy dose of reality as I started doing some outreach through the midwifery clinic where I would go like in a home and help someone get a latch every once in a while. I had to be very careful to stay in my lane and what I'm certified to do and not do. But at the same time in a really rural area where there's maybe four professionals, I say that with air quotes, in town that can then help someone. There's a lot of like, okay, I'm telling you this is a friend, not a doctor. Move his chin down. You know, it's like just this little stuff. And it was both the time of my life and exhausting. It's hard to help bring a national ecosystem down into a little town where just so many things are going against you. We don't have a pediatrician. You know, it's like we are we're tiny here. We don't have a pediatrician, we don't have a birthing hospital. People go out of town and come back with their babies. The the data is flawed because of that. We're just not getting the picture here in this town. I think we have like 12,000 people, maybe total, and spread out in a bunch of like middle of nowhere type rural coastal stuff. Yeah. But the people that are here are rock stars. And so I think that that was able to make it really work. But even after that, I was still very medication

Therapy, Medication Aversion & Finding the Right Care

23:46

averse. And what I noticed going to therapy, please hear me when I say I'm a total proponent of therapy. I am in therapy right now, every Thursday night. Shout out to my wonderful, amazing therapist. But I what was happening to me is that there was not anyone in my network and available at the at the time that was perinatal mental health knowledgeable. This was right before PMHC perinatal mental health certification became a thing. And so I didn't have I didn't have anyone like that. So I was seeing a teletherapist out of Portland at the time who was so kind and I really liked talking to her, but she did not have the knowledge or the training to help me focus on what was going on acutely in my life. And so what was happening is that my therapy sessions were uncovering bigger and bigger childhood traumas that were adding instead of focusing on like let's get this one thing out of the way. I stopped going because things were getting harder, not better. And I just didn't have this understanding that it gets harder before it gets better sometimes. And then my husband and I were talking divorce very quickly early on, even though we had had this like really strong marriage and a baby and mental health just undid us. And so we went to a marriage therapist here in town. She was okay. She helped us understand some issues and helped us communicate a little better. But even she didn't know that like men could have postpartum depression and those kind of things. So it was complicated to find the right care.

EMDR, Medication, CPTSD & ADHD Diagnosis

25:18

Yeah. And it was three years later before I finally accepted medication because of a new therapist that finally got connected with me, was able to do some really targeted and pointed like EMDR and help me really understand how to process trauma in a deeper way. And then my husband went to the therapist as well, not together, but in separate times, got on medication because she worked with our general doctor. And then we started to recover. When we do trainings through PSI, I moderate a lot of them. I'm the faceless person in the background of the Zoom typing into the chat. So hello to everyone that has had a PSI training. The voice be behind the text. I am the Cody from the PSI logo in the background of all these webinars. And I send out all the trainings. So hello. Anyway, we get this question every time we do a training, and that is how long does a PNAT or perinatal mood and anxiety disorder last if untreated? Well, the answer is your baby doesn't turn one or two and you go, I'm healed. Thank God I survived it with no intervention. It may not be in the DSM to clinically say I have postpartum depression and might have a six-year-old, but you can clearly have depression. An untreated trauma or an untreated depression is not going to just miraculously clear up on itself. You may, you may be outside of that perinatal period. Yes. Loose, you know. Yeah. And there may be life changes where things do get easier and depression does lift. There are certainly people that have experienced that, but nothing about my life was changing. I was just in this sort of brownhog state where every day was the same nightmare. And I had to have a very direct intervention of medication and EMDR to crack that code to get out of it. And I know some people don't want a label or a diagnosis, but in home visiting, there's a saying called name it to tame it, where you name your feeling and it immediately helps tame it in your brain. And I needed to name these diagnoses. So my official diagnosis, three years postpartum, was complex PTSD and ADHD. And I have never been more comforted in my life to hear that. I just really needed something to latch on to to research and understand better. And while both of those diagnoses are ones that, unlike depression, don't necessarily clear up. I now have the therapy, the tools, the understanding, and the medication to like live a fulfilling and happy life. And I was just a few short days into medication because ADHD medication works immediately, whereas something for trauma or depression takes a little longer. I was a couple of days into my medication, and I came into the room where my son, who was three, was, and I looked right at him and I just thought for the first time ever since he was born, the only thing I'm thinking is I love you. You're beautiful and perfect and sweet. And I was so overcome with emotion right then because I had never only thought that. Like I thought it, but there was so much noise. You had always been just a touch or a lot, more than a touch, disassociated with what was happening in that moment. A lot. It's like you were there, but you weren't there. Yeah. And I was never the mom to like sit down and play, or I was like the mom that kept you alive and cuddled, but not like, let me learn about you, let me enrich you. That was my husband. He was doing all that so well. Like, let me teach you the alphabet and let me sit with you and play with you and give you a life experience. And I was like, Oh, you need a diaper change, you need nursed, you need held, you need fed. And I was a utility parent and I just wasn't connecting. And medication was absolutely the key force and unlocking that other side of my brain to go like, and I like you. And I think you like me. Another thing I just like did not believe for a while. Yeah. I hear that with other high needs parents. Crying colicky babies typically don't give off like love vibes to new people. Yeah, like I love this loud little blob. Yes, exactly. It never stops screaming. And and yeah, and I um I was in therapy once after my son was already like five a couple years ago, and I was talking about the postpartum period, and she goes, When you talk about him now, you use his name, and when you talk about him, then you call him the baby. Oh so disassociated the baby that happened to be in my life at the time. And I don't shy away from talking about that, and I will talk to him about that when he's an appropriate age, you know, like when he's thinking of becoming a parent one day, if he does, is because I no one had told me that. I did no idea that was a possibility. And I think that there's this sort of disconnect between how to inform parents that are first-time parents that are pregnant about what might happen, while also not scarring them or scaring them. Because a lot of the trauma I experienced was just not knowing something was possible and then it was happening to me. But also, I was such an anxious pregnant person, I did not have the capacity to hear about every little birth intervention and mental health disorder that could happen. Recently talking to Wendy, she, as probably all the listeners of this podcast know, there's been some psychosis in the news lately. And Wendy asked me, can we talk about this on like a PSI level, like a strategy level? And is that going to be triggering? And I was like, no, it doesn't trigger me at all. And she's like, I wonder, it triggers some people. I wonder what the difference is. When I was immediately postpartum, I did not know it existed. If I had known, I would have been panicked about it. But if it had happened to me and I did not know about it, it would have been so much worse. So there's this balance between education and fear. We need to talk about it. It's a thing that can happen. Yeah. Here's what to look out for. Yeah. And if you are somebody that you know might be experiencing this, here's where to go. Here's some resources, here's some information, trusted information. Yeah, absolutely. And I came home after my PSI training when my son was about a year and was in a home visit with a mom I hadn't met. And thank God Wendy had described this sort of like how to speak to a parent, that sort of tell me more part, so you don't too quickly say, Yeah, that's normal. And I was utilizing that technique and heard some really disturbing things out of a mom. And she wasn't experiencing psychosis, but her depression was so much deeper than I knew that she like immediately needed help like that day. And I would have ignored it. I wouldn't have known. Yeah. Yeah.

Peer Support, PSI Helpline & Helping Other Moms

32:07

So then did you become a volunteer for PSI or did you lay in wait until this job? Yes and no. So I did not volunteer in an official trained registered capacity with PSI as a coordinator. However, I did take multiple calls from PSI Central when someone would call the helpline from this area. In fact, I was sitting with a mom one time, had her call the helpline because she was nervous about, had her call the helpline. Oh. She was nervous about calling. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, that's probably it's a very real thing. It's scary to make a phone call and talk about a thing. Very real. And so um sat with her. She made the phone call. She left a voicemail. I stayed for another hour. I got a call from PSI saying someone called and needs some support in your area. And I was like, Oh, I'm already here. So I'm sitting next to her. Yeah. Um, I outsourced this back to myself. Yeah, that's a true story. I feel like what happened was you met Wendy, and Wendy was like, I now know where you live. Like, I know that you're in this in the part of Oregon, not in a stalker way, not too much. No. Like she was like, You're in this part of Oregon. So when we get calls from folks in this part of Oregon, pass them to Cody. Yeah. Oh, totally. Absolutely. And in fact, that continued. So I moved three or four times after my son was born. So I lived in this part of Oregon, then I moved for work once. I moved for a family illness once. So I have come full circle. I'm now back in that same town currently in Southern Oregon, but spent a year in Nevada, spent a year in Tennessee, spent a year near Portland, and then back here. So I continued to receive calls about Southern Oregon during that whole time. And here's what I would do: I would pass that, it didn't happen all the time, but I would pass that information over to that original mom who was in this same small town who had been the one that placed the call. And she ended up getting some support from a neighboring town and getting medication through our midwife. So she became a good, not an official peer supporter through PSI's amazing program, but a peer supporter for people in this area. And so she would have literally people come to her house who were experiencing it and like sit with them and explain like here's what I went through. And full circle, and I won't name drop her, I'll let her name-drop herself because she'll probably be a guest. She now works for PSI

From Oregon Health Authority to Working at PSI

34:41

also. And so how I came to work at PSI officially, I was working at Oregon Health Authority. I am a Masters of Science student, hopefully graduate now that this is airing in data analysis and policy with a focus on prenatal mental health. Yes, I was working in operations for OHA and their amazing health promotion and chronic disease prevention section. We call it Hip Kidip, and I just had to say that in my mind. That's so good. We love the people at Hip Cadip so much. They're wonderful. And I saw a job within the state of Oregon that was a really great job that focused on maternal health. And I reached out to Wendy very professionally on Instagram to ask for a reference letter. And she was like, Yeah, absolutely. But before I do that, can we just have like a short chat? And um That's how it goes. But first, I just need access to your computer so I can delete um your resume. So you're not able to send that out. Yeah. And so we had a lovely talk. We had a lovely talk. And she's like, listen, I totally respect what you would like to do. I want to, I want to support your career. Well, absolutely write this letter. But I'm curious what your career goal is, and I might have an opening for you. And I just need the right personality to fit into this role. And I I think you're it. Please bear in mind that Wendy and I had not spoken except for like five minutes once in passing at a conference since 2016. We're in 2022 now. And she's like, I think you're the right personality. So she picked up my personality from my Instagram or my LinkedIn. From six years ago. Yeah. Yeah, no, she's good like that. She has really magic powers like that. And it's that crier from the two-day training, man. I've got my eye on her. Yeah, yeah. I'm gonna describe this for the podcast because it's a lot of hand motions. It's hard. I'm on the phone, I'm listening to her. She's kind of like getting to the point that like she might have a job for me. And I'm like, yeah, let me just think about it. I'm like sitting the phone down and doing that like scream, like silent scream, like, oh my God, such a dream job for me and for like everyone I know that has come to PSI. And um yes, yeah, I was like, Yes, me? Are you kidding me? Me? Cody's looking around behind her, she's picking up pillows. Is somebody hiding? Oh my god, who would be walking just in total shock? And I was like, Yes. I was like, I just need like like two days to think about it. And that's just me trying to be really professional. So I didn't I didn't know what I was doing. I just wanted to be like, oh my god. But I'm like, I have like this is a bit of a life change, it's a schedule change, leaving a job, health insurance, all that stuff, right? So I had to get that figured out, and it was such a seamless process, but I was nervous about it. And man, I was just thrilled. And what we quickly learned, Wendy and I, is that we have like the most quirkiest things in common that just make us work really well together. And I don't know, I feel like I love this role. I don't aspire to be Wendy's role. I think that's the key here. I don't want to be the director of PSI. I think she does that fantastic. And I am not trying to ever take over, upstage her, or even be like next in line, any of that. I just really love my role of getting to be involved in all the things and helping it operate and move without being on camera or on the in the news or writing articles. I am an like an analyst and an organizational person at heart and a writer above and beyond being someone who wants to be in the spotlight. And I think that is the magic sauce between us is that even though we're both introverts, she really handles that side of it really well and I think with ease. And I love being the person that's like, here's who you're meeting with, here's the details you need to remember, here's the email they sent, here's the document with all the stuff. And it's such a magical fit. And I had no idea, even a week before I got this job, that I wanted this job until I had it. And we have so so many weird things that connect us over the time. So we learned that the date of that training was the same week I started at PSI. So that training had been in the middle of March, and I started in the middle of March at PSI. Like on the same day. What? Yeah, like six years later. Six years later to the day. Get out of here. Yeah. That's wild. Yeah. So yeah, it's awful. Nice job. Way to go. Way to go, Cody. I love it. I don't know. I just love this work. I want to talk all day about it. So Wendy called you, and you were like, Give me two days to think about it. But what you were really thinking was, OMG, yes. Yeah. Be cool. Keep your keep your cool. Don't spook anyone. So then you were like, yes. And now it's been a year almost exactly. It's been a year. Yeah. It has. Oh. It's it's a big love fest. I really love like, yes, I'm bragging on Wendy because that's my main like coworker here, but I love all of you. I love all of PSI. I've worked many remote jobs, and I just really love this one. I feel really connected. Which is interesting because none of us are in the same location. Not even in the same time zone most of the time. I agree with you. I feel very, very connected to lots of people, and it is a good feeling to have coming out of a period of time, you know, during the pandemic where we were very isolated. Yeah. Yeah. It is a workplace like no other, I would, I would say, in the best way. It was hard to unlearn. I've heard this from other staff too. It was hard to unlearn the on the PSI side. I am not speaking to the hotline side. That's a very different type of thing. But on PSI's organization-wide, it was hard to unlearn the sort of rigorous, tight deadline drive of state work and come over to a place that is rolled with empathy. And it is so, so much nicer to not have to. I had good empathetic bosses before at the state, but the state is a system. We're all connected to a higher thing that's controlling all of us. And here at PSI, you know, if I have my coffee for 30 extra minutes, or if I take a nap, you know, a 30-minute nap in the middle of the day, as long as I'm not missing something key, a meeting or something, I have that freedom. I can get up and take a walk around the block or whatever. And it's so, so pleasant. Yeah. Do not have a stressful job and it does not stress me out. In fact, most days it makes me feel like it fills my cup just to be doing basic work. It's really cool. Even when it does stress me out, I'm still loving it. Exactly. Yeah. You know, like those memes about like hating going to work and like can't wait till work's over or whatever. I understand that because I've, you know, had so I don't feel that at all. And I'm like, ugh, I just kind of cringe because and at the same time feel so lucky. It's like exactly just constantly pinching myself. Yeah, like I last time I took a nap during the workday, I told Wendy about it. Not like in a blame way, it's just like I took a nap. And she was like, good for you. Rest is so important. I was like, I just don't know why I did it. Deserve a good boss. Like, what? Yeah. Just pinch me. Yeah, it is really important. Thank you. I think the thing that is missing in most other work environments is that like if you assume that the people doing the work care about doing the work, then you don't have to monitor or track or micromanage. Right. You can just be excited for them when they're having good balance. Exactly. Because otherwise we get so excited about the work that we're editing podcast episodes all weekend long. That that's the other thing. That this is like uh and here's the other thing. No, I mean, this this is work that every single person that works at PSI is so passionate about. It's everybody has that fire inside them that burns for this work. I love doing this work. And it doesn't, I mean, it's funny to call it work. That's again with the pinchy thing. It's like, oh yeah, I get to call this work. Like, this is our work. It's amazing. I can't, I mean, yeah, I absolutely love it. And I, what a love fest for PSI. I just think it's so great. And I like the proof that I just like a nerd about my job is that I not only did I download and subscribe this podcast, but I like listen to it when it comes out. I get so excited. Oh my god. Watch out, everybody. New favorite guest in town. It's gonna be on my Spotify, my Spotify rap because you're like, you're in the point zero zero zero zero one percent of listeners. Gold Star Cody. That um this is a great time to have a little segue. If you are

Lightning Round

43:58

consenting to a little Lightning round. Yes, yes. It might not be fast. It'll be a slow lightning round. Great time to segue into the first question of the lightning round, which is Cody, besides this podcast, what's your favorite podcast? My absolute favorite podcast, which has nothing to do with perinatal mental health at all, is Tig and Cheryl True Story. I am obsessed. Nothing makes me laugh as hard as those two ladies. It's Tig Notaro and Cheryl Hines. Yeah. Tig is a comedian. Cheryl is from Curb Your Enthusiasm. It's about documentaries. They like almost never talk about the documentary. They just talk about random things. And because it's been so random, it's got this cult following where there's like hidden jokes and lingo about it. Yeah. And so it's so much fun. I highly recommend it to anyone. It's easy listening. It's like PG. You can have kids in the background. They may cuss every once in a while, but it's super good. Tell us, are you in regards to books? Are you do you like listening to books in your ear or holding something in your hand? I need to hold a real book. Real book in my hand. I have owned a bookstore. I'm a diehard used book fan always. Do I have time to read right now? No, absolutely not. Parent, grad school, work, no. But when I do, I have a whole shelf right behind me of things waiting for my attention. And okay. Um currently my husband reads to me at night while I play my little iPad game. So we just finished Cat's Cradle by Kurt Vonnegut. That's awesome. That is some quality time. It's so nice. It just like replaces binge watching TV. So he reads and we like stop and comment about the book, and I play my little mind-numbing game, and it's super fun. What's the game that you play again? What's that called? It's called Bubble Witch 3. Yeah. It is better than Bubble Witch 1 and 2. Oh, they're I mean, in my opinion, the music's better in Bubble Witch 1, but I'm always playing when I have like a sleeping kid next to me. So I'm in Bubble Witch 3. Okay. And I'm very high on my personal leaderboard. No big deal. Oh, okay. I that's not where I thought that sentence was going, but okay. Cody, what do you like to do for a quick mental break? I really like to take a sensory shower. Oh yeah. Yes. At least at least once a day, sometimes more on a stressful day. I like a really hot shower. I like the lights off. I like good music. Sometimes music, sometimes the podcast that I'm listening to. And just like lock the bathroom door so that the kiddo doesn't pop in to turn the lights on and tell me something about like dragons or something. And now he's very interested in me not dressing him. That's a new thing, too. Oh. He's in charge of him. Oh but he has impeccable fashion. It's super fun to watch. Yeah. It's not like honestly random. At this point, I would welcome someone else telling me what to wear because it's the it's the deciding that like I just don't I don't want to do that anymore. I get it why people do like capsule wardrobes or like they they have like seven of the identical colored shirt. Decision fatigue, you know? It's real. Cody, what's your best parenting hack? My best parenting hack is I'm sure there's a better one, but this is the one that came to mind. And I got this from my my best friend Carly, who will listen to this, and I want it to be known that she taught me this. Shout out to Carly. She taught me that you can convince a small child to play a game called Bay Spa, where you lay down and your small child massages you and scratches your back and walks on your back and brings you crackers. And I gotta tell you, that is a game changer, and I still utilize it. I've been rolling with this game for five years, and I'm like, today's foot massage day at the spa, and it just it still works. It still works. And I'm gonna keep it up until he catches on. Okay. Yeah, that's my parenting. And and it started working at two. So he is still in diapers, it was working then. I just can't. Yeah, it's the one. And um, yeah, thank you, Carly. Changed my life like that, as she knows. I mean, the moment he quits on me, I'm gonna actually splurge and just get like weekly massages or bi-weekly or something. I'm I'm pretty much there anyway. It's just limited in this town. But I actually have a massage table. I picked up at Goodwill. I'm a very, very uh devoted thrift shopper, and I have a full-size massage table in my house. Dang, but it needs more attention. Well, what is one way that you'll show yourself some radical love today? Radical love today. I have two great things going for me today. I found a Starbucks gift card in a pile of papers that I forgot I had. I am a diehard Dutch Bros fan. Oh. For those of you not on the West Coast, I'm so sorry. But Dutch Bros is a drive-through coffee place. It is, it has a devoted following. People are either in or out at Dutch Bros. Like love or hate. I I love Dutch Bros. I'm obsessed with it. I really, really like it. But I got this Starbucks gift card, and they make uh iced and or a frozen matcha that is just I can't beat it. I can't find it to be as good anywhere else. And I'm a coffee drinker, but I do matcha when I go to Starbucks. So I'm gonna do that. And I have a grocery pickup. That is my weekly radical love, is that I don't like going into the grocery store. Yep. Order it online, go pick it up. Yeah. And then I have a good excuse to go to the thrift store today because I need a new mouse for my computer. And the one I'm using is gonna die. So I'm gonna use that as an excuse to like go touch all the things at the thrift store. Because you never know, there could be a mouse there or not. There might be something else. It may not be, but there could be like a designer blazer or like a new chair, or you know, you never know. Like I absolutely adore the thrill of the hunt at a thrift store. Well, you've nailed this this lightning round. This is great. Yes. Oh, good about it. Feeling pretty happy. I'm happy to recommend both a podcast and a book that had nothing to do with prenatal mental health. And I say that in balance. Oh, totally. Yeah. It's my work in school and my passion. And sometimes like I've switched gears. I radically switch in gears is self-care sometimes. So it is. It is. Silly, silly podcasts and science fiction. I like that people can talk about different things on each of our episodes here. Like, yeah, we can talk about like really serious stuff, but we can also laugh. Because that's life. That's and that's the thing too. Like in a like postpartum, it wasn't all bad. Like it was just a lot of things at once. You know, there were great moments too. And I think that's just like any part of life. Yeah. But I will tell you a closing story about the Mom and Mind podcast, because I'm not gonna be the only guest that doesn't brag about mom and mind with Dr. Kat. Oh, oh, you want to get in on this mom and mind bragging. I want to pile on on May. We did it first. But it's piani. So I'm listening to Mom and Mind. I'm in the grocery store. It's like 10 at night. I'm exhausted. I needed to get something. And I was having a hard day. I've got AirPods and I'm listening to the podcast. It opens, like a cold open. She goes, This episode is for all of the moms out there, just completely exhausted, maybe at a late night run at the grocery, just really having a bad mental health day. And I laughed so hard. I felt so called out. It was not even a newer episode. You were like, Is Kat behind the bushes over here somehow streaming into my earbuds? How did she see me? Yeah. I love mom and mine that listened to it also. And I it was a totally random episode, and I could not believe that that was the open. Like, how on earth did she the odds? Of course, I immediately called Wendy, like, you're never gonna believe what happened to me. Yeah, and she's like so fun. You're not gonna believe me, but I believe you. I I believe you. Yeah, we call that the PSI magic, just things just like randomly fall together. Yeah, yeah. Well, this has been super fun. I would love to do this all day. I know. Cody, thank you for sharing so much of your time with us today and telling us about your experience and just hanging with us. It's been a pleasure. Pleasure is all mine. It's been so fun. And I will continue to be the most devoted listener to this podcast until someone tries to unthhrone me. Those are some fighting words right there. Thanks

Episode Closing

52:39

for tuning in to the I Am One podcast. Check out today's show notes where we'll drop links to all the important things that we mention in this episode. Please consider sharing about I Am One on social media and following and rating our show wherever it is that you listen to podcasts. It only takes a minute of your time, and well, that'll help our collective mission of bringing resources and local support to folks worldwide. From everyone here at PSI, thanks again for listening.